Episode Transcript
[00:00:03] Speaker A: Hello, Oregonians, and welcome to Life and Legislation with Lucetta. If you've ever wanted to get to know your politicians personally or understand what it is they are actually doing, then you're in the right place. I'm your podcast host, Jessica Campbell.
[00:00:17] Speaker B: I'm your state representative for House District 24, Lucetta Elmer.
[00:00:21] Speaker A: This podcast is a place for you to get to know Representative Elmer both personally and professionally.
[00:00:27] Speaker B: We want Oregonians to feel connected with and educated politics. So we're so glad you've joined us on a fresh new podcast adventure as we cover all things about life and legislation.
[00:00:42] Speaker A: Hi, Oregonians. Welcome back to Life and Legislation with Lucetta. I'm Jessica and I'm so glad you're here joining us. If this is your first time finding us, welcome. If you want to go back to some previous episodes, we welcome you to do that so you can get to know Representative Elmer a little bit more personally and just get a feel for what we've been doing with this podcast. We want you to get to know her and try and understand how Oregon government works because so many of us, like myself, didn't really know other than maybe a little bit of what we remember from a high school class or something. So today's episode is all about money, and with everything going on at a federal level and a state level, it seems that more and more people are getting really curious about and interested in how these budgets work and where does the money come from, how does it get spent and so forth. So with that, we get to dive into our conversation with Representative Elmer. Thank you, Lucetta, for joining us for this wonderful money conversation.
Since this is Life and Legislation, we always like to include some of the personal life in our episodes. So just for fun, let's start with kind of a hypothetical with your personal budget. If you were faced with cuts, what kinds of things would be super easy to cut? And maybe what one or two things are your protect at all costs. Do not cut, no matter what.
[00:02:07] Speaker B: Yeah, I, I think that we truly do have lots of fat that can be trimmed. It's a blessed, it's a blessed life. And even when things are hard, I still think we, we're pretty lucky here where we live. But for me personally, Denny and I, we really do indulge in eating out. And that would be an easy one to just say, oh, we're going to actually buy food and eat at home.
So that would, that would be an easy one to start with and that would save because it's expensive to eat out. We could also look at Our car situation, because we do have extra cars and, you know, our businesses, a lot of times just coming downtown from where we live isn't hard. In fact, I could ride my bike, but I wouldn't want to ride my bike. If I had to go to Salem, that would be too much for me. So I would get the car that day.
And then, you know, we. We love to travel, and I would never want to cut it all the way unless I absolutely had to, because I think there's so much that you gain when you see other parts of our world and how other people process and live. But obviously, we could cut down on that and. And just, you know, live simpler would be an easy way to start.
[00:03:20] Speaker A: Yeah, absolutely. Well, before we dive into the Oregon state budget, how it works and how money gets spent, all of that, we have a little bit of an update on a particular financial situation that a lot of Oregonians have been following. And that is the transportation bill.
[00:03:37] Speaker B: Yes.
[00:03:37] Speaker A: And there's some updates on that. Right?
[00:03:39] Speaker B: Yes.
[00:03:39] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:03:39] Speaker B: The governor signed the bill Monday.
It would have automatically taken effect Wednesday, and Tuesday was a holiday, so. But. But she did. She signed it Monday.
And then we had everything ready to go. But so as soon as it gets signed and wanting to do a referendum, then you have to take your paperwork that you've prepared for that referendum process to the Secretary of state's office, and then they look over it, approve. That takes a few days.
So that's in the works right now. And then we will start. The very first day to start getting signatures will be this Saturday.
So that's very exciting. And there's several locations throughout Yamhill county right here locally that people can sign. And there'll be high visible places. It might be listed on the notaxor.com website, but I know that it will be very visible. There's several throughout the whole county.
[00:04:36] Speaker A: Right. And just as a reminder, if for anybody who is signing this, this is a signature that says, we want this on the ballot.
[00:04:43] Speaker B: Yes.
[00:04:43] Speaker A: And then it would be on the.
[00:04:44] Speaker B: Ballot next November, in theory, that's when it would be on the ballot.
[00:04:49] Speaker A: Okay.
[00:04:50] Speaker B: I have my suspicions that the majority party won't want that, and they may push it so that we actually have a vote sooner, but we'll see.
[00:04:58] Speaker A: Okay, interesting. And so the deadline to get all these signatures is December 30th.
[00:05:04] Speaker B: The end of December. Somewhere in there.
[00:05:05] Speaker A: Okay.
Amazing. And the goal is to get roughly 100,000 signatures so that there's plenty of extra.
[00:05:11] Speaker B: Yes, yes. Yeah, yeah. So it is. And there's been such a great movement of people who are willing to donate their time and be out there with the clipboards and, you know, just really coming together to make this all be seamless. So I, I think we're going to be successful.
[00:05:28] Speaker A: Okay, well, we'll get more updates. It'll be interesting to see how it all unfolds. And for anybody who's wanting to follow along, we can put those links in the episode notes, you can get more information. I'm sure it'll be blasted all over social media as well.
[00:05:40] Speaker B: Yes, absolutely. Yeah.
[00:05:42] Speaker A: So one of the reasons that everyone has been so interested in the transportation tax is because it's a tax and it affects our budgets, it affects our personal budgets, but there are also needs in the state. So it always comes back to this conversation of how do we pay for the things we need and want, how do we afford it and so forth. So for this episode, we wanted to almost go back to school, right. And understand how does the state budget actually work?
So where does. This might seem like a silly question, right, but where does the money come from? When the state of Oregon has a budget, where do they get their money? Presumably taxes. But are there any other sources?
[00:06:23] Speaker B: Yes, they do get them through taxes. So our income tax, we all pay that property tax. If you're a homeowner, we're paying that.
You have your corporate taxes, business taxes, but there are other revenues. So we have lottery funds, our scratch off tickets, our keynote games, we have bonds as well.
And then the other one would be federal funds as well as fees, licenses, those types of things that are collected. Think like, you know, if you're a hunter and you go to buy a hunting tag or you go to the DMV and you need to renew your license. So there's lots of different fees that are spread out through our daily living, but those are the sources that come in and I can break those down. Yeah, yeah.
[00:07:14] Speaker A: Well, you mentioned, I think generally speaking, most people will understand what most of those are. But one of the ones you mentioned that maybe we all hear, but we don't really understand how they work is a bond.
[00:07:25] Speaker B: Right.
[00:07:26] Speaker A: And I don't know if you can take just a moment to refresh anybody's memory or teach somebody who's like, what exactly is a bond? How does that work?
[00:07:33] Speaker B: So a bond is something that we would use if it were like a larger project or think like a university building or, or like an infrastructure project that's going to last a long time and it's going to be a much Larger investment that is something then that we would do and would be a debt. So like a mortgage where you're. You're paying that back, but, you know, you're getting the money and you're able to do these larger things. And it's not all coming out of general funds, because that would be way too much to take out in one year.
[00:08:06] Speaker A: Sure.
[00:08:06] Speaker B: So it's like a mortgage. It's spread out over time, and so it's borrowed.
[00:08:11] Speaker A: So essentially, if, you know, we kind of make this as simple as can be. Let's say there's, you know, a piggy bank.
[00:08:16] Speaker B: Right.
[00:08:16] Speaker A: And the state of Oregon gets money in their piggy bank from people paying taxes, the lottery tickets, fees, and so forth. And then if there's a big project that doesn't. There's not enough in that piggy bank to fund, then they. The state could get a bond.
[00:08:34] Speaker B: Correct? Yes. It's. It's not just for anything, though. So there's. There's parameters around that, and that is something that only the legislature can approve.
[00:08:43] Speaker A: Okay.
[00:08:44] Speaker B: So very much our system is set up for transparency, which I am a fan of, But I feel like at this point, there are so many layers within our agencies that one does have to do some digging. And I'm so thankful that we have this conversation. But the legislature has to approve all of it, all of the. What the money is used for and whether or not there's a bond, the executive branch, the governor, then her job is to go and do that. But she can't overspend what the legislature has approved. She could pull back if. If revenue isn't where we thought it would be, then she can pull back on some budget items, or we would have to go to the emergency board to shift funds around. But truly, the legislature is the body of government that sets all these budgets. Once those tax dollars comes in.
[00:09:43] Speaker A: And does that start at the beginning of a calendar year or a fiscal year where it's like, okay, here's all of our money. We have to make the plan for how we're going to spend it for the next 12 months.
[00:09:53] Speaker B: So we have a biennium, and I think so, you know, like, I have to run every two years, and so that's the biennium. So we're halfway through right now. I was elected last year for my second term, and then I'll be up for reelection next year. So let's say in 2024 we were elected. We go into 2025. And I think I've mentioned this before. Oregon operates on a long session and a short session. So our odd numbered years are long sessions and our even numbered years are short section sessions as well as election years. So I go in to next year in November, let's say I'm re elected, that's 2026, then 2027 hits and that's a new biennium because we've just been elected. So we go through a long session and in that long session is when the legislature is going to adopt the budget. We're going to, we're going to say here's our budget based on all of the revenue forecasts, our projections of, you know, how taxes, where they're at and how much we're getting. And then we look at all of the agencies and we set the budgets for those agencies. Now that can come from promptings from the governor. She, you know, she can say what it is that she thinks it should be, but then the legislature is who is going to ultimately adopt that. Once it's been adopted, then that is set until the, the next biennium. So if I'm elected in 26 and we go into 27 and it's adopted, then we're not going to do another one until 29. But we're not in session that whole time.
So once we've done that and we're done with session, then we still have essentially 18 months before another one is adopted. Now let's say life gets crazy and revenue just isn't coming in like we thought and we're not going to be able to really sustain that budget.
We have something called an E board, an emergency board, which is a smaller number of legislators, bipartisan, that can be called in to meet to do what needs to be done. Now they can't raise money, they can't go outside of what was passed legislatively, but they could shift things if needed to compensate. The governor can't do that. That's on the legislature.
The only thing she can do, remember, is she could stop funding. She could, she could pull back on where we're spending.
[00:12:25] Speaker A: So yeah, so theoretically, and I'll just use really simple numbers, right? So the state says, okay, we're forecasting that based on the number of people we have, what the property taxes are, yada, yada yada, we're going to get a thousand dollars for this year. Now we have this thousand dollars and we need to divvy that up as to, okay, 800 of it goes here, $10 of it goes here, a dollar goes here, $23 goes here and so forth. But if suddenly, oh, there's not $1,000. We only got $950. Then you have to take that $50 away from other places to kind of make it fit.
[00:13:03] Speaker B: In your proposal. You're saying, like, once the budget has been adopted, but then this happens.
[00:13:09] Speaker A: Just like that's kind of what the emergency group would do. They would go through and say, hey, we don't have as much as we thought.
[00:13:14] Speaker B: We have as much. Yeah.
[00:13:15] Speaker A: Now we have to. What are we gonna, you know, trim or move things? So we gotta move that $20 from over here to here. And of course, I'm using such simple numbers.
[00:13:25] Speaker B: Right?
[00:13:25] Speaker A: You know, I think sometimes we can get lost in the big, like millions, billions.
[00:13:29] Speaker B: And also I would say so property taxes, that's more of a county, a local money source. So income tax is where is where the money is going to come from.
[00:13:40] Speaker A: For the state level. Got it. And so as we talk about all the different things that the government does fund, what are some of those? I think, I mean, we might all know some of the basics, right? I mean, we've been talking about the transportation tax. Like, so clearly our roads and some things related to transportation are paid for by a state budget, public education.
And. And I mean, what are all of the things?
[00:14:04] Speaker B: Right? So you have that money that's coming in and. And you have the general fund, right? And then out of that general fund, you. So again, use simple numbers. You have a hundred dollars that comes in, and you want to make sure you can fund our schools, and you want to make sure you can fund our roads, our infrastructure. You want to make sure you can fund our law enforcement. So we'.
And then it just. The list goes on. So human services is a big one. We think of, you know, the Oregon Food bank right now going into winter. And, you know, you think of funds that. We have federal dollars that has been in the news lately that were on hold. The SNAP money that was on hold, that's federal. So that's a different. That's coming from, you know, the United States government dollars that we also pay into our federal taxes versus our state taxes.
But you have veterans, you know, there's money that. And you have early childhood, you have.
And I'm not talking necessarily preschools, but we have services to help support moms, parents that need support with babies and vapors and health care and.
[00:15:18] Speaker A: Yeah, I was going to say health care, hospitals, like any of those things.
[00:15:21] Speaker B: All the things.
And then to run the agencies, you know, the government employees, all of those jobs are funded by tax dollars.
So there's There is. There's just a lie. And how that all gets dispersed is the ongoing conversations that we have on the, you know, all over the Capitol during long session. But ultimately it comes down to the Joint Ways and Means Committee.
[00:15:48] Speaker A: Yeah.
And going back to kind of the example that's on everybody's mind here in Oregon is that is the transportation bill because there's a need that, okay, there wasn't enough money and. Or this was the, this was how it was presented. Right. There's not enough money to do what we need. We need more. So therefore these taxes and fees are going to be raised to cover that. And so constantly these conversations of if there's not enough money, what do you do? And generally speaking, the two parties will have different opinions on how to solve that.
And perhaps there are other solutions as well beyond kind of the two main party ideas. But that's a whole conversation in and of itself.
And you had already kind of explained who creates the state budget and how we get those reports.
And again, just kind of going back to if we're in debt, then what, you know, what, what are the options? And it's the same thing with a personal budget. Oh my gosh, there's not enough money or we're not going to earn as much, or all of our costs went up. Now what do we cut back or do we raise more money?
[00:16:56] Speaker B: So, you know, you've probably heard how the federal government is like trillions of dollars in debt. Right.
So that can happen at that level, but at a state level, we can't. We are not allowed to be in debt.
So we have to rebalance.
So right now, since we're in the middle of the biennium and obviously revenues came in less than what we had projected, we're looking at a $350 million deficit. So when we go back into session In February of 2026, that will be a main discussion because we can't sine die until we have that balanced.
So we will be looking at that. You know, what are the cuts that we need to make or reprioritizing funds. And you know, really, you're right with the transportation, I mean, you have limited options. You raise taxes to bring in more.
You cut something, you know, and you think about like your example at the beginning with our own budget, like, yes, you can look at it. And if you're not gonna have enough, then you cut something. Or maybe you choose to go get that second job so that you can bring in enough money to cover, you know, this for us, for Oregonians, you know, if the legislature decides that, well, we need to get another job or raise taxes to bring in more money, I mean, that's on us, that's on all of the citizens backs then to give more. Which I think is why we are feeling it's so important right now for all of Oregon to be able to weigh in on that decision with the gas tax because it does affect everyone.
So instead of 90 legislators making that choice, let's open it up and let.
[00:18:41] Speaker A: Oregon choose, give their opinion on, hey, do we want to raise the money for this or do we want to cut back? Yeah, I mean, that's a, you know, very basic level. I know that you had mentioned that your party had put forth some different solutions because there still is a problem, you know, and if there still is a problem, you still have to find a solution.
[00:19:03] Speaker B: Right.
[00:19:04] Speaker A: Which solution do you pick?
[00:19:05] Speaker B: Right.
[00:19:06] Speaker A: Were there, were there really just two main solutions put forth or lots of tweaks within those?
[00:19:12] Speaker B: So, you know, we've talked a lot about how I'm in the super minority, meaning that we can, we can stand over here and yell and scream and kick and stuff our feet, but at the end of the day, we don't have the votes to even get our idea onto the House floor where it could be voted on. And even if it were, you know, it can be voted down and there's nothing we can do. So we did have ideas on how we would spend the money within ODOT budget, Oregon Department of Transportation's budget, without raising taxes, but those were not accepted at any level. You can, you can have the idea. You could put forth a bill, you could craft a bill, I could craft a bill. But if the chair of the committee chooses to not bring the bill to committee, there's nothing I can do. And that really is up to the speaker of the House and the chairs and the committee. They're the ones who orchestrate or decide which bills get to be heard with the chance of them moving on to the floor for a vote. So there's a lot of power that a majority has.
So we did have our solutions, they just were not considered.
So when we knew that they weren't, we weren't going to have our bill put forth, then we tried to do amendments.
So the Democrat put forth a bill in the committee and we said, okay, well could we change this part? And so we make an amend an amendment. And those also were not considered.
So the only consideration for this specific topic was a raise in taxes right now. And I'm sure many listeners or Yourself have heard of dei, DEI to be equitable and inclusive. And that's been something that our majority party has put as a high priority.
It's something that, regardless of how one feels about it, I have wondered personally, how much money are we spending on it? And it's hard. You know, we talk about transparency, and I think the way in which our government structure is set up, it leans towards always wanting to present transparency and having the three different branches of government to balance each other. But it's challenging for me to find numbers on how much we spend. I know that there's been, you know, 70 million has been a number that's been floated, but when you look at the.
The agencies, there's layers and things embedded in different ways that it's hard to say was this specific or that specific. But I think, you know, looking at, let's say, 70 million is a significant amount to know that that's what we're spending on something that didn't exist before and maybe needed, but does. Is it needed to that degree or what exactly does it do? That's just a personal question that I've.
[00:22:12] Speaker A: Had.
[00:22:14] Speaker B: As one example of money that's set aside. But what exactly? How does it benefit all of Oregon?
[00:22:21] Speaker A: Yeah. Well, it seems like a lot of the conversations can. When you see them in the news, they can feel very black and white, like it's all or nothing. Right. As opposed to possibly the conversation that says, well, could we cut something? Doesn't mean we cut it out. Or it doesn't mean we don't think it's valuable, but could we trim 5% here or there? Because if there's only so much money. There's only so much money. Yeah. And if we can't go into debt, I mean, that wouldn't be a good idea anyway. But if the state truly cannot. Is not allowed to go into debt, you've got to do something.
And yet all of the individual people and organizations, nonprofits, children, seniors, veterans, you know, there's all these needs.
How do you meet all those needs? And I know part of the conversation is kind of about a bigger picture. What is the government's job?
[00:23:10] Speaker B: Right.
[00:23:11] Speaker A: How much should the government do? And people totally disagree on that. Right. On how much the government should be involved in solving these specific problems, which could be a whole separate episode of a conversation. But I did want to go back to something you have said several times I've heard you share at forums and on the podcast, that Oregon doesn't have a money problem.
It has a priority problem. And So I wanted to give you another couple minutes to maybe dive into that a little bit more.
[00:23:40] Speaker B: Sure.
Yeah. I think again, the Oregon Department of Transportation has probably been the one that's just been scrutinized the most. And so to say that, using that as an example, to say that we don't have the funds to make sure our snowplows are running on the roads, or we don't have the funds to make sure that our potholes are filled in, I just do not think that is accurate information.
I think we can prioritize and make sure that those things get done right away.
Now, maybe there's something else within the budget that doesn't happen, that doesn't get allocated. Like, for example, you know, our governor had said that there were X amount of jobs that were going to be cut from that department if we didn't pass this, this bill.
Well, half of those jobs had never been filled. They were just sort of like placeholder jobs. Like, yeah, we should go out and, and look for people. But it's not like you were actually cutting people. You were cutting positions that had never been filled.
So if we were operating already with that, then let's stop using the number that those positions collectively added up to and saying we're short because we're not short. We haven't. We have. You know, we can pull that back and use that when things get a little better. I think the other side of this, that, that my party really continues to try to elevate loudly is that we need to be more business friendly. That's where we get the money to add to the general funds, you know, and so when, right now, we know factually that we are losing more businesses than we are gaining.
That's huge. That's a huge red flag for any state to say your main source of income would be business, corporate taxes and income taxes. So people working at these businesses is, is negative. It's. It's less than what we have. You know, the pro. The positive impact on business. I mean, that is, that is a huge red flag. And so I feel very much the burden of, whoa, we need to address this right away. What can we be doing? What are our neighbors doing? What are, what's Utah doing? What's Idaho doing? What's California like? What are other states doing that aren't in the same position we are, that are seeming to be on a positive economic path? And let's, like our, let's evaluate are we doing that or are we not?
So that is something that I think we could just Fix or work on fixing and see a big uptick in how much money we have to work with.
[00:26:21] Speaker A: One of the things I've heard you say a lot is transparency.
And I believe you've mentioned that there are some places people could go to actually see some of these numbers broken down. Are there websites or, you know, places where all of this is public information? So if somebody's curious saying, well, okay, how much of the budget is spent on public education? How much of the budget is spent on our police force? How much of the budget is spent on. And then they can see the breakdown.
[00:26:50] Speaker B: Yes and no. I mean, yes, you can, you can look online, you can find all of this. You can go to our state website.
But as a legislator who sits in the committees and probably gets a more in depth depth, maybe I don't see anything more than, than any Oregonian could see, but I'm obviously at the table having conversations daily about this. It's still confusing and it's still challenging to weed through all of the layers and go, okay, but what are we spending on this? So. So yes and no.
[00:27:23] Speaker A: For anybody who's joining us for the first time, they may not have known that you are recently elected the House minority leader.
And so that's going to come with some new responsibilities and just the opportunity to continue to elevate the voice of the minority party. Right now. Let's just do hypothetical. If you weren't in a super minority and you were in a regular minority or even a majority, and you had the ability to kind of bring some of your party's values to the table, what would that look like? You mentioned business, that that would be maybe a top priority to work on making the state more business friendly. Is there anything else that you feel like you would shift if you had, you know, more, more power? Yes.
[00:28:08] Speaker B: Yes, there are. Thank you.
I really do not think it's hard to paint a picture of our state that makes people want to come here. I mean, we live in one of the most beautiful places in America, the Pacific Northwest. We have all the seasons. We are diverse in our topography. We have the, we have the ocean, we have the mountains, we have the high desert, lush valleys.
We just, we have so much to offer.
And I just think that people, when they, when they're here, they just always are in awe of our beautiful trees and the green that we have on this side of the state, the amazing wine, the tourism. I mean, there's just, just, there's so many things that make it attractive. You know, we do have all seasons but they're. We're pretty mild. You know, I. I appreciate that because I like the seasons and the changes, but I like that we're not in Wisconsin where we're scraping ice and shoveling snow all the time. So it's beautiful. And. But for people to come and make it their home, I think they want some basic things. They want to feel safe.
Right. They want to know if they have children, that those children are going to get a solid education.
They want prosperity. They want to know that they can succeed. Either there's. There are jobs that are available, or they can live the American dream and start a job or start a business that they're going to be successful with.
And what I see in our state right now is, are a lot of barriers to those basic things. Things. So it's not hard to get people to come here and they fall in love with it. But can they find housing? It's challenging and it's expensive.
Can they feel good about putting their kids into our public schools? No. We're ranking at the bottom of every single different listing out there in our schools.
Do they feel safe?
No, they don't feel safe. And we've taken away so many tools that law enforcement have in order to use to make us. Us safe.
So there's, besides business and doing what we can to deregulate some of the things we have in Oregon that would make it easier for businesses to operate. I think we also just have our basics. You know, are we putting priorities on those basic things that are going to be attractive and. And make Oregonians or future Oregonians want to come and live here?
[00:30:39] Speaker A: Right.
Well, it'll be interesting to see how things continue to go for you in this new role. And I know that it won't be long before there are more elections coming up. I know primaries kind of feel like they're around the corner. We'll get to talk about that and who's running and what do they stand for and, you know, who are they as people, what are their policies, their priorities and so forth. We'll get more updates on ODOT and what's going on with that. And certainly there are other things coming down the pipeline that are going to matter to Oregonians. So I'm always thankful that you take time to break this all down. I have even more questions that. That come up. And, you know, for those who are new to this, for those who are new to this podcast, you may have realized right away that politics. That's not my background. I am your average, very curious person that's going, what does all of this mean? And I've been so blessed to have Lucetta as a personal friend who would explain things to me. And that kind of launched this idea of, well, maybe other people might want this explained to them as well. So it's been a great joy to get to do this with you and learn some things. More question questions to come and more conversations to come as well. So thank you so much. And this is the week that we celebrated Veterans Day. So I did want to take a moment to thank all of our veterans, our active military and their families for everything that they have done over the years to make America, to make Oregon what it is today. And I know it's very easy to take that for granted. So from the bottom of my heart, from Lucetta's heart and our whole, our whole team here, thank you so much for your service and everyone who's been watching and listening. Thank you for joining us. We hope you learned some new information. As always, if you've got questions and want more information or curious about something, you can reach us by email. All of that information is in the episode notes and we would love to hear from you so that we can address any of your questions or ideas or concerns in future episodes. We hope you come back and join us next time for Life and Legislation with Lucetta.
